The US government shut down on October 1st, 2025. Parks stayed open — but the rangers, maintenance staff, and visitor center employees who make a park visit safe and meaningful were furloughed or operating on skeletal crews. Retired park ranger John Goodwin, returning to The Parks Podcast, joins Missy to share exactly what’s different in a shutdown, what visitors must do to recreate responsibly, and what happened the last time parks stayed open without adequate staff. Spoiler: it wasn’t pretty.
A note from Missy: A different sort of attack on our parks and public lands. What does a government shutdown mean for our parks? How do we visit responsibly and help our rangers? This episode sets the stage for supporting our parks through the shutdown.
Episode Guest
John Goodwin – Retired NPS Ranger & Author
Echoes of the Badge
(See also: Episode 27 — John Goodwin / Echoes of the Badge)
What Changes During a Shutdown
- Parks generally stay open (unlike earlier shutdowns when closures led to public backlash)
- Visitor centers: likely closed or reduced hours
- Maintenance staff: furloughed — no one cleaning restrooms or emptying trash
- Interpretation rangers: furloughed
- Law enforcement and emergency services: essential, remain on duty
- Campgrounds: may be closed, especially those nearing end of seasonal operation
- Backcountry ranger patrols: reduced or absent
- NPS websites and apps: may not be updated for current conditions
- National Forests, BLM: similar impacts — call ahead before visiting
How to Recreate Responsibly During a Shutdown
- Call or check websites before you go — conditions change; closures may be in effect
- Pack out everything — do not leave trash at overflowing cans (bears, ravens, and crows will spread it)
- Bring supplies to clean up after yourself in restrooms
- Respect closed gates and signs — do not walk or drive around closed areas
- Stay on trails — no rangers means no one to prevent ecological damage
- Know your skill level — emergency response times will be longer; do not attempt backcountry trips beyond your experience
- Be kind to the rangers you do see — they are there because they have to be, often stressed and understaffed
- Consider state parks — often state-funded, less impacted by federal shutdown
Episode Transcript
Our Parks and the Government Shutdown — How to Recreate Responsibly
The Parks Podcast, Episode 41 | John Goodwin, Retired National Park Service Ranger & Author, Echoes of the Badge
Note: This episode was recorded during the government shutdown that began October 1st, 2025. Some specific conditions referenced reflect that moment in time.
What Does a Government Shutdown Mean for Our Parks?
Missy Rentz: I am joined by John Goodwin. You guys know him because he’s been on episodes before. John is a retired National Park Service Ranger and author of Echoes of the Badge: Stories from a National Park Service Career. John, welcome to The Parks Podcast again.
John Goodwin: Thank you, Missy. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
Missy: I feel like I always come to you when I just don’t know how to interpret what’s going on with the parks, and this is no exception. As of midnight on October 1st, the United States federal government shut down due to a lack of agreement on how to fund the government. It can get really confusing — I feel mixed messages, my social feed is all over the place, and it does mean different things for different parts of the government. But for our purpose, what does it mean for our National Park Service units and the public lands?
John: So things have changed over the years from when I first started as a ranger back when we had prior shutdowns — it would mean closing the parks, and the public was not happy with that. Probably some of your listeners remember especially Washington, D.C. and all these places closed, and Republicans and Democrats would use this opportunity not only to grandstand about how much they love the parks but to keep them closed at all costs. And then it changed. Now, for the most part, they’re open. Now, when I say open — your listeners should be aware when they go to a national park unit, and there are 433 park units across the country, not just the big ones like Sequoia, Yosemite, Yellowstone — there are a lot of smaller ones. They’ll probably see, especially at the smaller ones, closed visitor centers. In some cases, closed campgrounds. For other public lands like National Forests, which are Department of Agriculture, you may see campgrounds closed. We’re getting into fall and campgrounds can be closing anyway for the winter, so you may see some managers closing those campgrounds early.
John: What I would recommend is please call ahead, go on the website. Just know that your visit is going to be different during the budget shutdown. Some states like Colorado, the governor is stepping in and giving state money to the national park units to keep those parks going. In other cases there’s visitor fee money that the parks can use to pay for employees. They’re going to have essential employees out there — the law enforcement, the firefighters. But anyone working in maintenance, that’s a different story. You don’t have anyone cleaning up the restrooms or any of that stuff. And interpretive rangers opening up the visitor centers or people at the entrance stations — those positions may not be staffed. It’s only going to be essential stuff. You’re going to find things closed and you’re going to find trash cans overflowing, dirty restrooms. If you go backcountry hiking or backpacking, you have an emergency, there may not be anyone immediately available to come get you. Be aware of that.
What Are the 433 National Park Units?
Missy: So when we talk about national parks, there are the 63 national parks — the big guys — but there’s also several hundred others. What are those designations?
John: There are 433 national park units that are out there. That would include your national battlefields, your National Lakeshores, your National Wild and Scenic Rivers, your national monuments. The list is quite extensive — if I remember right, there are well over 20 designations of different sites. And sometimes it’s surprising — even at Golden Gate National Recreation Area, where I ended my career, a lot of people who would come visit Ocean Beach or Sutro Park would be surprised they were in a national park unit and to see a ranger there. We’re scattered all across the country and in the territories as well.
Why Are Some People Calling to Close the Parks?
Missy: In my social feed, I see a lot of pleading to close the parks. Why is there an effort to get the Department of Interior to close the parks?
John: Because of what happened last time during the prior shutdown — it was a disaster. So you look at an overflowing trash can and you’re like, eh, not a big deal. When the shutdown’s over, they can just come and bag up the trash. They’re forgetting the crows, the ravens, the squirrels, the bears — they’re going to rip that trash and spread it everywhere. And especially when you’re dealing with bears — a fed bear is a dead bear. So you open up the parks, you have all the visitors come, and they’re not doing what they should in situations like this and pack their trash out. You’re going to have trash flowing everywhere, restrooms that are a mess, less protection out there guarding the Anasazi sites. People are going to look at this as an opportunity — without rangers out there — to go and steal. And that was an issue from the last shutdown. That’s why a lot of people are saying: close the parks. Please safeguard the parks.
Missy: Yeah. You read the stories of the devastation — not just trash and messiness, but the vandalism and the ecological devastation because people went off trails and just weren’t recreating responsibly.
John: Absolutely. And in some cases, the animals that are going to be affected by this in a negative manner. But also the archaeological sites — when you got vandalism, even spray paint, good luck trying to clean that up. You’ve pretty much just ruined an area. Or doing off-road travel — you might have just ripped up a very fragile area with your vehicle. I do not know what possesses people when there’s no rangers around. And by rangers, I mean interpretive rangers, maintenance, everyone wearing the uniform — it just seems that when there’s no rangers around, people just act so irresponsibly. Not everybody, but there’s a certain portion of people that do that. And it just drives us nuts as a ranger. Why would you do this?
What About the National Forests, BLM, and Other Public Lands?
Missy: You come from the National Park Service. Are there implications we should be aware of for the other public lands — the National Forests, the Bureau of Land Management, these other places?
John: Absolutely. The forests again — you’re going to find less employees working there, if any. And you’re talking about also, in the past nine months, there have been devastating cuts already to the workforce. And then you look at non-essential employees getting furloughed right now — you’re going to find even less. National Forest, BLM — any public land that’s affected by this federal budget shutdown is going to be negatively affected.
Should We Visit Our Parks Right Now?
Missy: I have Acadia on my list to visit starting this weekend. Should we visit our parks?
John: That’s probably something that each of your listeners is going to have to decide for themselves. Now, if you don’t visit your national park unit or your public land, you won’t be spending money probably on the little towns that border these public lands, so you’re going to negatively affect their economy. So that’s something to think of. If you do make the decision to go — please be responsible. It’s not that hard to follow the rules. Follow the rules even if there’s not a ranger looking over your shoulder. Pack out what you bring in — not just talking about backcountry camping, I’m talking like front country camping too. Pack out your trash please. If you see a trash can that’s overflowing, don’t try to stuff more trash in there. Help by packing it out. Bring things to clean up the restroom after yourself. I’m not talking about going in and cleaning public restrooms all by yourself — I’m talking about cleaning up after yourself. If you see a gate closed on public land because of the budget shutdown, don’t go around the gate. During shutdowns, we would close off portions of the park, and of course people would just walk around them. If you see a gate closed, please don’t go past it. Please don’t go into the backcountry and think it’s open season — you can camp wherever you want. No. Please don’t. Be responsible and try to do the right thing.
Missy: I like your point that everybody has to make that decision for themselves. I’m currently thinking about hitting state parks instead. I think this is an opportunity to see what else is around. There are a lot of local and state parks that usually butt up against national land. That may be a good option for you right now.
John: That’s a great option. Absolutely. And I’ll get off my soapbox in a minute — but really what drives me nuts with these budget shutdowns is it’s only during these times that you see them coming out and saying they love our public lands. Keep them open. And that’s both sides of the political spectrum. I wish they would be out there the rest of the year increasing the park budgets — please bring back our rangers, bring back everyone who works within the 433 national park units, please increase our budget. Just don’t pay attention only when the parks are shut down. And that’s also for your listeners — national parks and all public lands are getting attention right now. Don’t forget about them when the shutdown ends. Contact your local representatives. Contact the White House. Tell them to increase the funding, because it’s great to have visitors, but when you don’t have staff because your budgets are slashed every single year, it does no one any good. Don’t forget about the parks.
Missy: And I think we are in election season, and I think it’s important for you to voice your opinion through your votes. Everybody’s saying they love the parks right now, but what are people’s records and how they do or don’t support the parks? This is a good time to remind our government and elected officials that the parks and our public lands are important to us.
John: Absolutely. Agree completely.
Missy: So John, we’re on like day two or day three of the shutdown. The longer this goes, the more we’re going to notice the lack of staffing at the parks. We just need to be prepared.
John: Absolutely. If I could just share a real quick story — I went backpacking in Yosemite, tried to do Half Dome and Clouds Rest, and didn’t see a single backcountry ranger. This is before the shutdown. And the ranger in me came out and I was having to educate people heading up towards Half Dome about the dangers of lightning, the dangers of rain on the granite if they’re going up the cable route or up to Clouds Rest. That was before the shutdown. Be prepared if you’re going to go to the public lands — there’s less rangers now, there’s less staff now than there was before. Now you’ll find hardly any since the past nine months. It’s been decimated. So please recreate responsibly. Be safe. Have fun if you go. But just please pack out everything. Be kind to the resource.
Missy: Thank you, John. And I’d like to put an open invitation — the longer this goes on, if there’s more questions, we regroup and put together another episode just to keep the listeners informed on how to recreate.
John: Sounds good.
Missy: Thank you. I also want to mention that the second edition of John’s book, Echoes of the Badge: Stories from a National Park Service Career, is now out. It’s more stories, right John?
John: Yes, absolutely. I arranged the stories a little bit more chronologically and there are a few more stories in there — even detailing what I’ve been doing the past nine months, just trying to do my part to fight for the public lands. It’s not only on Amazon. It’s published through Ingram and through Lulu, which means you can go to independent bookstores or the big brand-name ones like Barnes and Noble and order the book if it’s not already on the shelf.
Missy: You can also listen to the episode we did with John earlier this year that was specifically about the book. I just wanted to make sure I mentioned that your second edition was out. John, I just want to thank you for being part of this episode and helping educate us on what’s going on with the parks and how to use them right now.
John: Missy, thanks for doing what you’re doing. I really appreciate it.
Missy: Absolutely. That’s it for this episode. Until next time — we’ll see you in the parks.
Music for The Parks Podcast is performed and produced by Porter Hardy. Follow us @TheParksPodcast or visit TheParksPodcast.com.