Episode Guest
Jessica Bowser
Virginia Outdoor Adentures
Speed Round
What is your earliest park memory?
I grew up in Cleveland and there’s a large metro park there and there’s a particular area called Squire’s Castle. If I remember the story correctly, there was a man who was building what looked like an actual stone castle before this was a park for his wife. And maybe his wife died or left or something happened, and it never was completed.
But there is still the foundation and the walls of this huge stone home that was meant to be, at some point, a home, and it’s now a park. And my grandparents used to take me and my brother and sister there as a child and the. The castle part of it was especially cool, a little bit creepy, a little a little fairy tale-ish.
That part was really cool. And then I can remember my grandmother picking mushrooms and showing us different things that she had found and just picnicking there and having very slow, peaceful afternoons of picking dandelions and just like playing tag with my brother and sister and different things like that.
That is definitely one of my earliest park memories. I wanna go back there one of these days, next time I’m home visiting. I told myself I need to check it out because it’s been so many years since I’ve been there. I wonder if it looks the same. But I think it’s those early memories that help us make those connections to parks and to continue to love them as adults.
What made you love the parks?
It is connection. It’s all about memories and connection and that feeling that you get when you’re enjoying parks. You can always bring that feeling back, whether it’s days, weeks, months, or years after you’ve had that experience. Or at least for me personally, if I can just close my eyes and think about it, I can think back to 30 years ago, or even longer than that, and what that was like and what those afternoons were like, it just brings back a lot of joy.
And I can remember joy and love and all of those things and time with my grandparents. I wish that everybody could have those types of experiences in the outdoors.
What is your favorite thing about parks?
That they’re so accessible to everyone, especially here in Virginia. I think we’re really blessed to have parks within an hour’s drive of our home no matter where we live in Virginia.
What is your favorite thing to do in a park?
Gosh, it’s funny because my brain immediately goes to hiking or kayaking? Or is it birding? But actually, what it really is, is the ability to do any and all of those things at my own pace. Sometimes I’ll just be at a park and I’ll be moseying on down the trail. And I don’t know if it’s because I’m daydreaming or something catches my attention, but I’ll stop.
I find myself not moving for a really long time. I’ll be listening, like listening for the birds, listening for any wildlife. Sometimes just enjoying the sound, whether it’s like a stream bubbling or a waves slapping. Feeling the breeze on my skin or smelling like the different scents that are in the air, whether it be wild flowers or even just decaying leaves or wet soil.
It’s such a sensory experience. And maybe 20 minutes later, I snap out of it. I’m like, how long have I been standing here? And so I think really what I love most about it is just the ability to do that, to, to be so engrossed in the experience regardless of what I’m doing, whether it’s hiking or birding or kayaking or something entirely different, I can do it at my own pace and really get the most benefit out of it.
What park have you yet to visit but is on your bucket list and why?
Oh goodness. I would have to say something outside of Virginia. I don’t know if there’s a park in Virginia that I haven’t been to yet. So during the pandemic, I was supposed to visit Banff National Park in Canada, and because of the pandemic, the borders were closed, I never got back there every summer.
There was a different reason why I couldn’t get back. I would love to go, not just a Banff, but there’s a neighboring park. I think it’s Jasper.
What is your favorite campfire activity?
Hammocking. I have a hammock with me all the time. When you talked about having things in your car that you can just grab easily. A hammock is in my car at all times and I usually throw it in my pack and have it at camp with me too, so I can string a hammock up almost anywhere pretty quickly.
Tent, camper, or cabin?
If I owned a camper, that would be definitely part of it, and I hope to one day. My family owned a camper as a child, so I have some really great memories of camping in a camper. So between tents and cabins, gosh, how do you pick one? They’re two completely different experiences, and they’re both amazing. Especially ’cause we have so many great cabins and campgrounds here in Virginia. I think it’s a tie, Missy.
Hiking with or without trekking poles?
Definitely with, I was a without for way too many years of my life. And then someone gifted me trekking poles, and I was like, “how have I made it this far in my life without these?”
And what is your favorite trail snack?
I love to dehydrate foods. I have a dehydrator at home, and so I’ll slice oranges and apples and other veggies and fruits and put them in the dehydrator. And then I have healthy snacks ready to go all the time.
What is the best animal sighting that you’ve had?
Oh gosh. I’m so torn between al of the different birds and snakes. It’s so hard to choose. So I’m a birder, and every now and then, you get a bird that doesn’t belong in the area that shows up. And nobody knows why it’s here or how it got here, but everybody’s really mystified and just excited about it. And so a really great bird sighting, whether you expect to see it or not is such a joy.
But so are snakes. I’ve gotten really into logging my snake sightings the same way that I do my bird sightings. I used to be one of those people who were terrified of snakes. So, I get it. If somebody’s thinking “snakes, oh my gosh. No way, I’d run the other way.” Once I’ve learned to appreciate them and realize that there’s nothing to be fearful of now, I just really get excited when I see one. And there are so many different species of snakes all around Virginia that I keep track of them in my guidebook.
What is your favorite sound in the parks?
Hmm, I’m gonna go with birds again because I have learned over the years that just the sound of birds is enough to calm me down. When I need a break in the middle of the day, if I step outside and hear the birds singing, my mood lifts immediately.
What is the greatest gift the parks give to us?
I think if we look back at where parks originated from, they originated outta the 1930s New Deal era and this idea that the common “man”, the “common working man,” and I put that in quotes because that was the thinking at the time needed a place to recreate and needed a place to take their families.
And this idea was very much just an idea until one or two parks opened. And then they realized just how much these public lands were needed for our mental health and our physical health. And now also because of conservation reasons. And so when I think about what those people, what those visions, gave us, I’m really, really grateful and those parks are now here for us to benefit from hopefully, if we take care of them for a very, very long time.
So I think the gift that those people gave us and the gifts that the park gives us are one and the same.
Transcript
SPEAKER_01:
Our parks provide endless activities and adventures, and our guest in this episode is passionate about teaching us how to enjoy the great outdoors. Join us as we explore Virginia outdoor adventures. I’m your host, Missy Renz, and this is the Parks Podcast. Today, we are so lucky to have Jessica Bowser, who is the host of Virginia Outdoor Adventures. Through her podcast, she takes people on adventures and teaches them all about the great fun that can be had in Virginia. Jessica, welcome to the Parks Podcast.
SPEAKER_00:
Thank you so much for having me, Missy. I’m a big fan of your show.
SPEAKER_01:
Thank you. Likewise. Mutual admiration here. So you are in the middle of your fifth season of Virginia Outdoor Adventures. That’s more than 80 episodes. And you share so much knowledge about outdoor fun I use your episode to guide my own adventures. Why did you decide to get into the podcast world and share these amazing stories?
SPEAKER_00:
Well, I am a lifelong learner and educator and also a huge outdoor enthusiast. And I think there are so many incredible opportunities right here in Virginia that people don’t know about. And so for years, I have been exploring Virginia and sharing those experiences, usually on a personal level, like on my personal social media accounts with friends and with family and neighbors and things like that. And so over the years I had a lot of people say to me, Jessica, you really should write a book or start a blog. And I thought, yeah, well, who’s got time for that? Great idea, but not me. But then the pandemic hit five years ago and I was sitting at home trying to figure out what to do with my time, just like so many of us were. And the idea of a podcast came to mind and I thought, I’m just going to give this a try for fun. And so I started it. I had a couple of episodes. that I launched and I really didn’t know what to expect. So I was incredibly surprised when the podcast sort of took off on its own. And I remember thinking, who are these people who are listening to this? But I think it was the right place in the right time. Everybody was looking for a safe way to be outside and to de-stress and to be able to see people in an environment that they didn’t have to worry about getting infected or infecting other people. And so it was just the right place in the right time. And so the podcast kind of took off and it hasn’t stopped. Like you said, I’m in season five now. I have officially 71 numbered episodes, but bonus content included is like over 80 episodes. And I can’t honestly, Missy, I can’t honestly believe that I’m still doing it. But I think it just goes to show that I’m not the only one who thinks that Virginia is a beautiful, beautiful state with lots of opportunities for outdoor recreation.
SPEAKER_01:
Yeah, not at all. And one of the things I really love about yours, like the Parks Podcast, we talk about a park or a public land. And you really talk about a lot more about the adventures that can be had in these places and sometimes parks, sometimes rivers, sometimes just all over. Have you always been an adventure person?
SPEAKER_00:
Yeah, I think so. I was fortunate to grow up in an area that had a lot of outdoor space and my backyard was really interesting because it literally dropped off a cliff into what was known as Metro Parks. I grew up in the Cleveland area and so I had wildlife coming through my backyard all the time and I I just remember being really fascinated by the outdoors and spending almost all of my time outside as a child. And I used to love watching the foxes come through the yard and the wild turkeys and the owls and the deer and being just enthralled with the changing of the seasons and all of it, really. So I think I made that connection to nature, which I think is a big part of it, too, because I’ve met some folks who haven’t discovered the outdoors until they were adults, and they have very different connections with the outdoors than I do because I think mine came from a place of falling in love with nature and of course you can do the outdoors any which way you want there’s no right or wrong reason but I have friends who like for example are trail runners and they’re just trying to get a certain number of miles in or long distance backpackers and and they’re flying down the trail because they’ve got a goal in mind and it’s to get to the end and and that style’s not for me but that’s okay if that’s your style so I have always really loved the outdoors and I can’t imagine myself not being in the outdoors. I love the way you say
SPEAKER_01:
that. You can do the outdoors any which way, because I think that’s really true. And I think sometimes people can get maybe nervous or hung up on that they should be doing it a certain way or have certain gear or something like that. And that’s just not the case.
SPEAKER_00:
That’s right. Yeah, the gear especially. There’s so many gear junkies out there. And people have asked me if I would do like a video showing my gear closet or going through all of the things that I own. And I’m like, well, it’d be really short because even though I’ve been doing this my whole life, I don’t want to accumulate a bunch of junk and I don’t want to spend every last dime I have on more and more gear. Like for me, it’s really about focusing on what are the things that I’m going to use most, like get the best use out of what’s the best bang for my buck and, and not fall into that trap of buying more and more and more. I mean, the consumerism around outdoor recreation is just the same as it is with clothing and everything else in our society. So you can get sucked in pretty easily. I think anybody who’s walked into an REI store will would realize that pretty quickly. But it’s really focusing on just the piece, the key pieces that you need. And and that’s really it for me.
SPEAKER_01:
So you have introduced me to so many different things in Virginia, I have spent a majority of my life here. And I love that, to learn that you are not from here, because you would think it with how knowledgeable you are. But through your stories and episodes, you show you’ve shown me a different for Virginia. What kind of stories do you look to tell? And how do you go about crafting them?
SPEAKER_00:
Well, I think first and foremost, it’s about community. The outdoors has communities within it. All of us who live in Virginia are a community, regardless of whether or not we engage in outdoor recreation or other activities. But we are all a community here in Virginia. And then as you get to know folks who love the outdoors, you start to find all these other smaller communities within it. So For example, there’s a mountain biking community and a climbing community and a caving community. So people find their niche and then they find their people and they get really engaged in it. And it’s really cool to meet the folks because they’re so passionate. And I find myself becoming a member of all these different groups and it’s through them that I really learn about all of these other activities that I didn’t know about. As you said, I didn’t grow up here, but also even if you did, unless you’re really tuned into that kind of stuff, you may not even know that these communities exist around you. So I love the sense of community. And as I’m telling stories, I try to keep that top of mind when I’m sharing what there is to do here in Virginia, because a lot of folks, especially if they’re newbies, might be feeling a little bit intimidated. And I think if you can find other people like you, then you’re much more likely to feel more comfortable and to get engaged. So for example, I have episodes that focus on like different hiking groups, not just hiking, right? So for example, I just recently did an episode with the hiking group, Girls Who Hike Virginia, and they are very, very active. They do hundreds of events all across Virginia every year. And some of them are beginner level. Some of them are more advanced. They even have a backpacking subgroup within their group. So there’s a lot of different opportunities to find your people and get engaged. But I think community is key for a lot of people when it to grow as an outdoor recreationist. And I love that you’ll
SPEAKER_01:
do things too that are tangential to the activities. Like you’ve talked to naturalists and authors and you’ll talk about forest bathing or you advocate for the parks. And I think it’s just really interesting how broad you have made the story, but it’s all about outdoor fun.
SPEAKER_00:
Yes. And I think all of those things, they’re all connected. I have people ask me a lot about the advocacy components of things. And when I think think back about why we have parks today. It’s because somebody had a vision for the parks and what they would do for our community and the role they would play. And they invested in that vision. And it’s because of that, that we have parks today. So if we don’t continue those investments, then we won’t continue to have the same results. We won’t continue to benefit from the parks that we have because they have to be maintained and they have to be funded. And so if we can start that or maybe I should say continue that conversation. I feel like a lot of people aren’t, they just simply aren’t aware of the investments that are required for parks to continue to thrive and be available to all of us.
SPEAKER_01:
Yeah, that’s so true. And I think also I love reading a lot about the medical benefits or the environmental benefits because it’s keeping the shore from eroding or whatever. They’re so much more valuable than just a place to
SPEAKER_00:
recreate. I think that’s right. And if we love the out And we have to be willing to pay it forward and protect
SPEAKER_01:
them. explore something that I had never explored. What kind of different places do you like to introduce people to?
SPEAKER_00:
Well, really, my favorite thing to do is to introduce people to things that they didn’t know existed here. So we touched on that a little bit, but I would be willing to bet that a lot of your listeners don’t even realize that we have caving in Virginia or we have ice climbing or we have elk tours. And so I try to introduce people to those different things, things like foraging for wild edible plants, birding, for example. So these are all different ways to experience and enjoy the outdoors. And so that’s really my favorite thing to do is is to open people’s eyes to what they have available here and to do it all from a beginner friendly perspective when people hear ice climbing they’re like i’m not gonna ice climb but almost anybody can really it’s much easier than you would probably think and if you’ve got a guide who knows how to do it safely and can teach you to do it with all the correct gear it’s a great outing for a day it’s a lot of fun so all of the episodes that i have are very beginner friendly with the idea in mind that many people have never tried it before.
SPEAKER_01:
How many times or how often do you do an episode and it’s the first time you’ve done it?
SPEAKER_00:
Many. Really? The ice climbing one, for sure. The caving one, for sure. Foraging for wild edible plants. Yeah, really like a lot of these things I had never tried. Even mountain biking. I did an episode on that a couple seasons ago. And I always get together with the guest that’s on that episode even before we record. Because I need to experience these things to be able to talk about it and have a conversation with my guest. And a lot of times it’s the first time I’ve ever done that. So I have another caving episode coming up here really shortly with some rangers from Virginia state parks, because believe it or not, some of our state parks have caves and there are public caving tours available through the park. That’s something a lot of people don’t know about. So I did a wild caving tour a while ago for an episode about caving in general, but I’ve got one coming up. about these programs through state parks, which is an excellent opportunity for somebody who has no idea how to try caving, but want to do it in a safe way. A ranger-led program is a perfect way to do that.
SPEAKER_01:
Oh, I totally agree. And the other thing that I noticed from your socials, you do a lot, is you do meetups and group hikes and invite people to come out.
SPEAKER_00:
Yeah, well, usually I’m joining up with somebody else’s group hike, like tagging along and then letting people know that I’m going to be there so that they can join if they want. I don’t host my own hikes usually. And I’ll be honest with you, Missy, that’s just an insurance thing. I’m not going to purchase an umbrella policy to take people on a hike. But I do like to get together with people and to see people in person. And so I do my best to let folks know where I’m going to be and encourage people to come out. That’s neat.
SPEAKER_01:
Okay, so these activities that you’ve done, what have you been introduced to that you’re now a huge fan of?
SPEAKER_00:
What am I not a huge fan of? I mean, there really isn’t Yeah, there really isn’t anything that I haven’t enjoyed. There hasn’t been a single thing. I even went surfing, was it two seasons ago? And that I was kind of like, oh, I don’t know about this. It was much harder than I thought it was going to be. I don’t think I ever even made it up on the board, but I ended up with a boogie board and was just riding the waves. I felt like a child, like, you know, when you’re sitting on the beach and there’s some little kid on a boogie board and they are just having the time of their life. That was me for the first time, probably since I was as a child. And it took somebody to say, it’s okay for you to do this. Who cares who’s watching? And it doesn’t matter what anybody else thinks. This is fun and just let yourself go. And so I did. And it was an absolute blast. The problem with that though, is that I end up with way too many new hobbies. I’m like, when am I going to find time to do all of these things? And my poor husband’s like, we need a bigger house for all of this gear. Exactly. I’m like, I need a rooftop tent and I need a kayak and a paddleboard and all these things. And I guess that circles back to you have to be careful. You don’t go down that rabbit hole, but yeah, I have picked up a lot of new hobbies in addition to a lot of new friends. There’s so much to do. It’s just, it’s a lot of fun and it gets me even more excited to share it.
SPEAKER_01:
I love to hear that you have to give yourself sometimes the little pep talk, because I do think that sometimes going out and trying something new. We talk about outdoor activities, but I think this is across the board. can be intimidating and that fear or whatever it is could prevent you from trying something. And so I think it’s so important for people to hear that you do all these amazing things and you sometimes need the little pep talk.
SPEAKER_00:
Oh, yes. In fact, I quite often have people say to me, you’re so brave. I admire everything you’re doing because you’re so brave. And I’m thinking, who are they talking to? I’m looking around going, what? Who? Is there someone standing behind me? I mean, really, I don’t feel like I am an at all. But I think what the outdoors has given me, and this is on a very personal level, is an ability to challenge myself in a way that nothing else has. And by that, I don’t mean being stupid or being reckless. But if there’s something that I would like to try that I’m nervous about or I’m intimidated by, if I can get myself through it, I come out on the other end going, man, I’m such a badass. I ride that wave for a long time. And it could be something as simple as solo backpacking for a night night or two, or maybe solo camping in a new place. Anything like that can feel intimidating. And even as a child, I was terrified of the woods at night. And there’s still a little bit of that hanging on even at my age. And so I know that there’s nothing out there that can get me except maybe another person. So if I’m smart about it, then I should be able to enjoy these activities safely. I do tend to push myself occasionally and take on challenges that I never thought I could do, but it’s so rewarding. when I’ve done it and then I think, okay, what’s the next thing? I love that. When you
SPEAKER_01:
host these conversations, what do you hope people take away from it?
SPEAKER_00:
I hope they have the information and the inspiration they need to plan their own adventure in Virginia. I hope that people can feel like they have the tools that they need. I hope that the questions and the lingering doubts have been answered. And I hope they feel that they can reach out if they do have additional questions or If I can put them in touch with the right people to help them plan a trip or to get started in an activity that they’re curious about and make that connection with the outdoors. And I think I’ve done my job because ultimately I really want for people to connect with the outdoors. There are so many reasons that we need to preserve our public lands and our outdoor spaces and adults who are not motivated or connected to the outdoors. outdoors are simply not going to be motivated to protect it. And so we have to get people started as young as possible, frankly. And even if that means getting people engaged as adults, so be it. Let’s get them engaged and let’s get them connecting to the outdoors so that when it’s time to advocate for them, we’ve got a whole army that’s ready to go to protect our outdoor lands.
SPEAKER_01:
Beautifully said. Okay, let’s talk about planning a trip to or planning a visitor for these activities. If someone is just starting to explore outdoor activities, what would you recommend that they do in order to learn and to get more comfortable to start this hobby?
SPEAKER_00:
So first of all, I would say they need to find a trustworthy source, whether that be a parks website or your podcast, Missy, because you have I’m really impressed. One of the one of the reasons I really love your podcast so much is because you really do your homework and you talk to people who are trustworthy sources. In this day and age, there’s just too many social media quote unquote influencers who are out there trying to make money off of posting content about the outdoors when they really don’t know what they’re doing. And there’s a lot of misinformation that goes out there and people end up getting hurt or also they attract a lot of people to places that cannot accommodate huge crowds that are going to be damaged, maybe even permanently damaged or have other other problems arise out of too many visitors in too small or delicate of a space. So find a trustworthy, reliable resource that’ll give you the information that you need. That’s the first thing. And the second thing is to find your community. Again, I think that finding like-minded people that are at the same level that you are, whether that’s beginner, intro, intermediate, advanced, makes a really big difference. Because if you’re thinking you’d like to go for a hike and then that morning you wake up and you’re like, you know what? I don’t know if I want to do this anymore. Now I’m having doubts or it looks like it might rain or whatever, or I just don’t feel like it today. If you’ve got somebody waiting for you with the trailhead, that sometimes makes the difference. And then once you get out there and you’ve done it, then you’re like, oh, this is fantastic. I can do it again. But if you miss that opportunity, it may not happen again. So I would definitely recommend finding a buddy, an adventure buddy, or a great community that can support you. I
SPEAKER_01:
just want to go back because I think the point you made I’d never thought of is the trusted resource I can vouch that you do respond when people have questions because that’s how we met is I started sending you direct messages and I think one of the things I did is I would go oh okay wait Jessica follows this person I trust Jessica and if Jessica follows this person therefore I trust this person and I think it just really helped to build the online community that I trust and where I got information versus to your point just searching for a hashtag and assuming that that everybody that’s talking about Shenandoah National Park knows Shenandoah National Park.
SPEAKER_00:
Right. That’s exactly right. And then the other thing, the third thing I just thought of as you were talking, you mentioned gear and gear sometimes being an obstacle for people trying new activities. And that is absolutely true. I would also say that there are really great local outfitters all across Virginia that can help you find the gear that you need. And many of them carry consignment gear. And that is such a great opportunity opportunity one because you can get the gear at a much lower cost than full price but also you’re really doing your part to make sure that gear doesn’t end up in a landfill and you’re not buying into the whole consumerism around outdoor recreation and the outdoor industry it’s kind of a catch-22 with the outdoor rec industry because we want to get people outside and we want them to have the gear that they need but also a lot of these brands are just producing and producing and producing and they’re constantly changing their colors and their styles, even though it’s really the same thing all the time. So consignment is a really great way to try something out and to be able to afford what you’re looking for. Another really great opportunity, in case anybody doesn’t know this here in Virginia, is there are educational programs that will allow you to try out something new. Like, for example, Virginia State Parks has this program called Let’s Go Adventures, and you can learn to fly fish or do archery or orienteering or kayaking or hiking or camping, and even now backpacking. And they bring all the gear to you. So if you’re thinking like, gosh, fly fishing looks like something I would be interested in, but you’re not going to go out and spend hundreds of dollars on a fly reel and a tackle box and all those different things just to find out you don’t like it. So you can sign up for one of those programs and learn how to fly fish and then decide, do you want to invest in the gear? So I would recommend that as well. Yeah, it’s
SPEAKER_01:
brilliant. You and I are both a big fan of Virginia State Parks, and they do so much. with their ranger programs and with their education programs to help introduce people at all levels to activities and initiatives within the parks.
SPEAKER_00:
Yes, they are fantastic at that.
SPEAKER_01:
Okay, how do you go about planning a visit? Like if you say it’s a Wednesday and you’re like, I’m going to go do this activity this weekend, how do you go about planning? So
SPEAKER_00:
I think one of
SPEAKER_01:
the
SPEAKER_00:
things that is really helpful is having the tools that you need already at your disposal so that if it’s Wednesday morning, morning and you wake up and it’s 75 degrees and the birds are singing and you think, I’m just going to call in sick today and go somewhere. You don’t have to get hung up on things like, what do I need? Where am I going? How do I find them? How do I download a map? Because now I, you know, I can’t find the maps. It’s really helpful if you have all those things at your fingertips so that you can decide at the last minute you want to go and do something. So for example, like for Virginia State Parks, if there are parks that are near you, go ahead and download the Venza app and download the maps for each of the individual parks that are say within a two hour drive of your house so that you will always have those available at your fingertips the moment you decide you want to go like have your pack ready with the 10 essentials packed inside and a water bottle and whatever else you think you might need extra clothing of course so that all you have to do is grab it and go eliminate all of the mess that has to happen the planning that has to happen to be able to do that. Do it ahead of time and be ready to go. But as far as like just thinking through what you absolutely need to do, think through what has to be with you. And of course, that is the 10 essentials. Don’t forget how much water you need to have. Don’t underestimate that or how much food you need to have and never, ever underestimate the weather because that can change at a moment’s notice. So making sure you have the 10 essentials, the gear, the food and the water and then maps and all of these things are part of the 10 essentials anyway. But having your maps prepared ahead of time or knowing where you can get one quickly, whether that’s the visitor center or perhaps it’s on the sign at the trailhead. Have a couple of apps on your phone that have GPS trackers as a backup, not as a replacement for a paper map, but as a backup so that you can actually see where you are on the map as you’re moving throughout the trail. Make sure your phone is always charged. Make sure somebody knows that you’re going and when you’re supposed to be back and what the plan is in case you don’t comeback. Like your at home buddy should preferably be one or two of the same people that you notify all the time so that you don’t have to explain to somebody, hey, I’m going hiking today and here’s what I’m going to need you to do in case something happens so that they know the plan. So those are some of the things that I would recommend doing ahead of time. And once you do that, when the decision comes, I want to go do something, then you’ve eliminated obstacles to keep you from doing it. And it’s much more fun. You’re not going to waste the first two hours of your decision just preparing to go out.
SPEAKER_01:
And we’ll put a link to the Avenza app in the 10 Essentials list on the Parks Podcast website on this episode page for everybody so they have easy access to it. I think it’s a great idea. And I also really love the idea of whoever you tell, make sure they know what to do. Because if you tell someone who doesn’t know how to call the ranger station or whatever the case may be, then that’s not going to be very helpful. So I really liked that idea.
SPEAKER_00:
Yes. And I’m just going to add too that that plan could change depending on where you’re going. I would recommend folks, so I just literally released this week an episode about wilderness survival skills. And the guest there is Tim McWelch, who owns a business called Advanced Survival Training, where he teaches people these things. But we had this conversation about how if somebody does get lost, you do not want to call 911 or the local police or the local sheriff because then it’s considered a missing persons. And most missing people are never actually missing. They’ve run away or they’ve left and haven’t told somebody and then they usually end up coming back. So nothing happens in the first 48 hours of a report like that. Instead, you want to make sure that you’re calling the park or the ranger where that person is hiking so that and to say that that person is lost or hasn’t come back and then they can activate search and rescue to come look for you. So you have to be smart about who you notify if you don’t come back. Whoever is watching out for you needs to know that information. Yeah,
SPEAKER_01:
it’s such a good point. I can’t wait to listen to that episode. So we’ve talked a lot about the equipment and kind of the stigma around equipment, but there’s a couple other sort of stigmas of outdoors that I’ve heard. And I thought you would be the perfect person to talk about them with. The equipment is the number one. I don’t know what I need. It’s too expensive, whatever. And we’ve talked about that. The other is fear, fear of outdoor creatures, fear of getting hurt. And I think legitimate and you can, you can manage those, those
SPEAKER_00:
stigmas for sure. Yes, definitely for sure. For sure. The more informed you are, the less likely you will be to be concerned about some of these things because most of the stigmas around things that you really don’t need to be concerned about, things like bears and snakes and spiders, stuff like that, there’s a lot of fear around animals and there just doesn’t need to be. I mean, black bears here in Virginia, unless you attack them or provoke them, they’re usually more afraid of you and they’re either going to keep doing what they’re doing and ignore you or they’re going to leave. So as long as you keep your distance and you don’t entice them by having food at your camp or something to that effect. And snakes, I did this really awesome episode about venomous and non-venomous snakes in Virginia. And the guest on that episode had so much energy. I highly encourage people to listen because she loves snakes. But she talked about how we only have a few species of venomous snakes here in Virginia. And even venomous snakes, any snakes at all, they’re not interested in you and they’re not going to chase you. you and they’re not going to attack you and all of that so if you come across a snake all you really need to do is just step around it and avoid it and and keep your distance the things that you do need to be concerned about are ticks the littlest thing that nobody ever thinks about is the thing that could actually do the most damage so ticks and i have a great episode about ticks and tick-borne diseases and then the weather is a big one because the weather can change and a lot of people especially newbies don’t realize that mountains can make their own weather I think the majority of the jackets and sweatshirts that I own in my closet that say Shenandoah National Park came from the gift shop when I showed up in the park because it was 90 degrees in July at my house when I left. And then I got up there and it was like 65 degrees and windy and looked like it was going to rain. And I was unprepared, right? So you live and learn, but learn from my mistakes and try not to make your own. Just always have all of the layers, all of your rain gear with you because because you just never know. Something can come out of nowhere and it often does. I was hiking once in Shenandoah National Park and a thunderstorm rolled in and oh my gosh, I have never been stuck in a storm like that. It was so insane. I was standing on a ridge top and I actually saw it coming. The skies around me were completely blue, but this one massive cloud just kept getting bigger and bigger and it was rolling my way. And so I was like hauling butt back towards the car and it came over me so fast And the way the lightning was coming down, I was like, I don’t know if I’m going to make it, but I was less than a mile from the car. So I just kept pushing and pushing until I made it back in my car. And when I got in, I took this video of like this torrential downpour. The video is just like this crazy loud noise of all of the lightning and the thunder and the rain coming down. And I was like, oh my gosh, if I were a through hiker, I would have been terrified, like absolutely terrified.
SPEAKER_01:
As you’re telling it, I have a little bit of fear of of putting myself in that position. And then a little bit of awe because it must have been really stunning to watch.
SPEAKER_00:
Yes, yes, yes. Because you have that moment where you’re like, wow, that’s so cool. And then when it hits you, you’re like, this isn’t cool anymore. Yes, yes, yes.
SPEAKER_01:
And it’s so funny because so many people, when I pack to go, I’ll just do a day trip to Shenandoah most of the time. And I’ll pack and people are like, how long are you staying? And kind of criticizing how much I pack. But if you have your vehicle, go ahead and put all the gear you need in it And that way, when you get there, you can just sort through and figure out what works for that situation.
SPEAKER_00:
Yes. I think if you have the ability to just have it with you all the time, that’s a great plan. And then the last thing I would say about fear is fear of other people. And this one I think is also very real and it sometimes gets brushed aside. Like I’ve listened to other podcasts talk about threats to people in the outdoors and they’re like, and we’re not going to talk about people because that’s not really a thing. I’m like, oh, but it is, it is really a thing. And this is not to scare anybody but there are so many stories out there of people who have come in contact with other people who meant to do them harm and so you just have to be very mindful and it’s a very personal decision how you handle that so like I can’t say to you this is the right way to handle that situation for me personally my preference is to choose trails where there aren’t other people and off that kind of goes against some of the more common advice that I often hear like I will hear people say you should stick to busier trails like the Appalachian trail because there’s always somebody that’s going to be coming by. Well, I hike the Appalachian Trail at all times of the year. And unless it’s July in Virginia, where there’s a through hiker coming by every few minutes, it’s not true that there’s somebody coming by on a regular basis. And because the AT is so populated, unfortunately, for somebody who’s looking to target a person, that’s a good place for them to go. Because they know somebody could be walking by by themselves at any moment in the forest. And those stories exist, like those things have happened. So for me, I choose trails where I think I’m not going to see anybody. So you really have to make your own decisions on that. Maybe doing a little bit of research, asking other people in the area what their experience has been on those trails. And then of course, having a buddy with you is always going to be the safest.
SPEAKER_01:
And I think all of these stigmas and fears, you can overcome them. And it’s not about, to your point, scaring people from doing it. It’s about just being aware. And for me, it’s a gut feeling. If it doesn’t feel right and you see a bear ahead, then remove yourself from that situation. If it doesn’t feel right when someone’s approaching you to talk, then remove yourself from that situation. Yes. Don’t make it prevent you from going out. Absolutely. Exploring.
SPEAKER_00:
Yes, I agree.
SPEAKER_01:
Jessica, at the end of every episode, we do a speed round of questions. Just answer with the first thing that comes to mind. Okay. Okay. What is your earliest park memory? I
SPEAKER_00:
grew up in Cleveland and there’s a large metro park there And there’s a particular area called Squire’s Castle. And if I remember the story correctly, there was a man who was building what looked like an actual stone castle before this was a park for his wife. And maybe his wife died or left or something happened and it never was completed. But there is still the foundation and the walls of this huge stone home that was meant to be at some point a home. And it’s now a park. And my grandparents used to take me and my brother and sister there. as a child. And the castle part of it was especially cool, a little bit creepy, a little fairy tale-ish, but that part was really cool. And then I can remember my grandmother picking mushrooms and showing us different things that she had found and just picnicking there and having very slow, peaceful afternoons of picking dandelions and just like playing tag with my brother and sister and different things like that. And that is definitely one of my earliest park memories. I want to go back there one of these days. Next time I’m home visiting, I told myself I need to check it out because it’s been so many years since I’ve been there. I wonder if it looks the same. But I think it’s those early memories that help us make those connections to parks and to continue to love them as adults. And what made you love the parks? It’s connection. It’s all about memories and connection and that feeling that you get when you’re enjoying parks. And you can always bring that feeling back, whether it’s days, weeks, months or years after you’ve had that experience, or at least for me personally, if I can just close my eyes and think about it, I can think back to 30 years ago or even longer than that. I don’t want to give away my age, Missy, but thinking back to all those decades ago and what that was like and what those afternoons were like, it just brings back a lot of joy and I can remember joy and love and all of those things and time with my grandparents that I, of course, don’t have anymore. And, you know, I wish that everybody could have those types of experiences in the outdoors what is
SPEAKER_01:
your favorite thing about the parks
SPEAKER_00:
that they’re so accessible to everyone especially here in virginia i think we’re really blessed to have parks within an hour’s drive of our home no matter where we live in virginia and what is your favorite thing to do at a park gosh It’s funny because my brain immediately goes to, well, is it hiking or is it kayaking or is it birding? But actually what it really is, is the ability to do any and all of those things at my own pace. And sometimes I’ll just be at a park and I’ll be moseying on down the trail. And I don’t know if it’s because I’m daydreaming or something catches my attention, but I’ll stop. And I find myself not moving for a really long time. I’ll be listening, like listening for the birds, listening for any wildlife Sometimes just enjoying the sound, whether it’s like a stream bubbling or waves lapping, feeling the breeze on my skin or smelling like the different scents that are in the air, whether it be wildflowers or even just decaying leaves or wet soil. All of those things are so, it’s such a sensory experience. And maybe 20 minutes later I snap out of it. I’m like, how long have I been standing here? And so I think really what I love most about it is just the ability to do that, to be so engrossed in the experience, regardless of what I’m doing, whether it’s hiking or birding or kayaking or something entirely different, I can do it at my own pace and really get the most benefit out of it.
SPEAKER_01:
What park have you yet to visit, but it’s on your bucket list and why? Oh,
SPEAKER_00:
goodness. I would have to, I mean, I would have to say something outside of Virginia. I don’t know if there’s a park in Virginia that I haven’t been to yet. So during the pandemic, I was supposed to visit Banff National Park in Canada and because of the pandemic the borders were closed and I never got back there every summer there was a different reason why I couldn’t get back so I think I would love to go not just to Banff but there’s a neighboring park I think it’s Jasper which is much smaller but it’s literally right next door and so it’s not as well known as Banff and doesn’t get the same amount of attention so I actually think that’s a little bit higher on my list because it’s the same type of experience but with less people And I’m very mindful of visitation, especially in my position, not only getting to go to a lot of different parks, but getting to know and meet the rangers and the conservation officers and the wildlife biologists and the other people who maintain our public lands and learning from them about the impact of all this visitation. So I’m very mindful now about going to places that are already highly visited. And Banff is very highly visited because it’s such a beautiful place. So I think I would probably go to Jasper.
SPEAKER_01:
What are three must-haves you pack for a park visit?
SPEAKER_00:
Well, the 10 essentials are on the top of the list, so that’s 10 things, and then I always have a camera, and I know that’s gotten to be a little old-fashioned these days with everybody having cameras on their cell phones, but our cell phone cameras don’t capture the same type of images, and for me, photography is a hobby, and it’s one other way that I can engage in the outdoors and sort of engage my creative side, so I I always have a camera with me. And then especially now as we’re getting into the warmer months, I am putting my head net back into my bag. And that was the best$10 I’ve ever spent in my life. To have a head net that protects you from the bugs when you’re hiking is a must. I think especially here where we have a lot of humidity and the bugs like to swarm around your head and fly into your eyes and your nose and your ears, that can ruin the experience pretty quickly. So a head net for sure. What
SPEAKER_01:
is your favorite campfire activity?
SPEAKER_00:
hammocking i have a hammock with me all the time when you talked about having things in your car that you can just grab easily a hammock is in my car at all times and i usually throw it in my pack and have it at camp with me too so i can string a hammock up almost anywhere pretty quickly and when you’re in the parks
SPEAKER_01:
are you tent camper or cabin
SPEAKER_00:
if i owned a camper that would be definitely part of it and i hope to one day i did as a child my family owned a camper as a child so i have some really great memories of camping in a camper, but I don’t have one now. So between tents and cabins, gosh, how do you pick one? Like they’re two completely different experiences and they’re both amazing, especially because we have so many great cabins and campgrounds here in Virginia. I think it’s a tie, Missy. Are you hiking with or without trekking poles? Definitely with. I was a without for way too many years of my life. And then someone gifted me trekking poles. And then I was like, how have I made it this far in my life without these? What is your favorite So I love to dehydrate foods. I have a dehydrator at home. And so I’ll slice oranges and apples and other veggies and fruits and put them in the dehydrator. And then I have healthy snacks ready to go all the time.
SPEAKER_01:
What is your favorite animal sighting?
SPEAKER_00:
Oh, gosh. I’m so torn between all of the different birds and then snakes. It’s so hard. hard to choose. So I’m a birder and every now and then you get a bird that doesn’t belong in the area that shows up and nobody knows why it’s here or how it got here, but everybody is like really mystified and, and just excited about it. And so a really great bird sighting, whether you expect to see it or not is such a joy, but also so are snakes. Like I’ve gotten really into tracking or I get, well, tracking, is that the right word? Logging my snake sightings the same way that I do my bird sightings. And I used to be one of those people who was terrified of snakes. So I get it if somebody’s thinking snakes, oh my gosh, like no way I’d run the other way. Once I’ve learned to appreciate them and realize that there’s nothing to be fearful of, now I just really get excited when I see one. And there’s so many different species of snakes all around Virginia that I keep track of them in my guidebook. And that has really added to the fun too because you just never know when you’re going to run into one.
SPEAKER_01:
What is your favorite sound in a park?
SPEAKER_00:
I’m going to go with birds again because I have learned over the years that just the sound of birds is enough to calm me down. Like when I need a break in the middle of the day, if I step outside and I hear the birds singing, my mood lifts immediately. So I’m going to stick with birds. And what is the greatest gift that the parks give to us? Well, I think… I think if we look back at where parks originated from, and they originated out of the 1930s New Deal era, and this idea that the common man, the common working man, and I put that in quotes because that was the thinking at the time, needed a place to recreate and needed a place to take their families. And this idea was very much just an idea until one or two parks parks opened and then they realized just how much these public lands were needed for our mental health and our physical health. And now also because of conservation reasons. And so when I think about what those people with those visions gave us, I’m really, really grateful. And those parks are now here for us to benefit from, hopefully, if we take care of them for a very, very long time. So I think the gift that that those people gave us and the gifts that the park gives us are one in the same.
SPEAKER_01:
Jessica, I am so grateful to you for being on the episode. And I’m particularly personally grateful because you really have helped guide me on how to enjoy Virginia in a different way. And I’m excited that we’re introducing you and your podcast to so many other people because I think you are a gift and what you’re giving is such a gift to all of us.
SPEAKER_00:
Thank you, Missy. And I think, honestly, you’re doing doing the same. I love the work that you’re doing. And I’ve been so impressed since the beginning. And I think that’s why you and I connected the way we did because I think that we think along the same lines of sharing information for other people so that everybody can enjoy these beautiful places. So I appreciate you having me on.
SPEAKER_01:
Yeah, thank you so much. And thanks for listening to today’s episode. Until next time, we’ll see you in the parks. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed today’s episode, please be sure to like and share on your favorite podcast Music for The Parks Podcast is performed and produced by Porter Hardy. For more information, please follow us on Instagram at The Parks Podcast or visit our website at theparkspodcast.com.